Gay Marriage is now totally a thing.

Isgrimnur
Isgrimnur
Ruling (PDF)

[size=12pt]Held: The Fourteenth Amendment requires a State to license a marriage between two people of the same sex and to recognize a marriage between two people of the same sex when their marriage was lawfully licensed and performed out-of-State[/size]
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Comments

  • leo8877
    leo8877
    GT Member
    :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
  • Caine
    Caine
    GT Member
    I expect certain people to be very upset about this.


  • ATB
    ATB
    GT Member
    on 1435331663:

    I expect certain people to be very upset about this.



    on 1358949565:

    There's a 0% chance that SCOTUS upholds any type of legislature banning gay marriage. I'm not sure constitutionally how they possibly can.



    on 1372260439:

    It's the right decision constitutionally.


    Now watch as freedom of religion is systematically attacked and eroded.
  • Gratch
    Gratch
    GT Member
    Yay!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

    on 1435333273:

    Now watch as freedom of religion is systematically attacked and eroded.


    How so?

  • farley2k
    farley2k
    GT Moderator
    Great thread title! :thumbsup:
  • Caine
    Caine
    GT Member
    on 1435333273:

    on 1435331663:

    I expect certain people to be very upset about this.



    on 1358949565:

    There's a 0% chance that SCOTUS upholds any type of legislature banning gay marriage. I'm not sure constitutionally how they possibly can.



    on 1372260439:

    It's the right decision constitutionally.


    Now watch as freedom of religion is systematically attacked and eroded.

    I wasn't referring to you, ATB. Go look at any right wing twitter account today. They are blowing up now.
  • Isgrimnur
    Isgrimnur
    GT Member
    How about TX Gov. Greg Abbot?

    [quote="Personal Twitter"]Marriage was defined by God. No man can redefine it. We will defend our religious liberties. #tcot[/quote]

    [quote="Official Twitter"]SCOTUS has become an unelected nine member legislature. I will continue to defend the religious liberties of TX http://bit.ly/1SQch4t[/quote]

    Link goes to the Office of the Governor's official page:

    “The Supreme Court has abandoned its role as an impartial judicial arbiter and has become an unelected nine-member legislature. Five Justices on the Supreme Court have imposed on the entire country their personal views on an issue that the Constitution and the Court’s previous decisions reserve to the people of the States.

    “Despite the Supreme Court’s rulings, Texans’ fundamental right to religious liberty remains protected. No Texan is required by the Supreme Court’s decision to act contrary to his or her religious beliefs regarding marriage.

    “The Texas Constitution guarantees that ‘[n]o human authority ought, in any case whatsoever, to control or interfere with the rights of conscience in matters of religion.’ The First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution guarantees the free exercise of religion; and the Texas Religious Freedom Restoration Act, combined with the newly enacted Pastor Protection Act, provide robust legal protections to Texans whose faith commands them to adhere to the traditional understanding of marriage.

    “As I have done in the past, I will continue to defend the religious liberties of all Texans—including those whose conscience dictates that marriage is only the union of one man and one woman. Later today, I will be issuing a directive to state agencies instructing them to prioritize the protection of Texans’ religious liberties.”


    I wonder what the financial damage to the state is going to be if he tries to fight this.
  • farley2k
    farley2k
    GT Moderator
    I just don't understand that thinking. Of course 9 people decided for the nation. That is their job. The whole point is to stop "mob rule" so that that just because the majority of Americans think something they can't force it on everyone.
  • Isgrimnur
    Isgrimnur
    GT Member
    Religious institutions aren't going to be forced to perform ceremonies against their will. They've long had exceptions to equal protections based on religious matters. You don't have to hire a Lutheran minister that applies for a Presbyterian pastorship, you can even have religious tests in what are nominally nonreligious positions such as daycare providers.

    But you aren't going to be able to work in a county clerk's office and refuse to issue a license. At that moment, you are an agent of the county, subordinate to the laws of the state and the country. You will perform your duties as a government employee. If your religion prohibits you from performing it in good conscience, you are free to seek employment elsewhere.
  • Isgrimnur
    Isgrimnur
    GT Member
    on 1435333589:

    Great thread title! :thumbsup:

    Thanks.
  • Lee
    Lee
    GT Member
    on 1435333273:

    Now watch as freedom of religion is systematically attacked and eroded.


    What does this have to with your religion? You are free to believe and worship however you want. Marriage is contract that has financial benefits that shouldn't be limited by a religion's sense or morality.
  • TiLT
    TiLT
    GT Member
    It's kind of amazing that so many Christians seem to believe that their religion invented marriage and that the concept somehow belongs to them. Newsflash: Stealing something doesn't make it yours.
  • rittchard
    rittchard
    GT Member
    on 1435331663:

    I expect certain people to be very upset about this.


    I was super upset because now I have no excuse to avoid getting married! :crybaby:
  • Gratch
    Gratch
    GT Member
    on 1435334971:

    Religious institutions aren't going to be forced to perform ceremonies against their will. They've long had exceptions to equal protections based on religious matters.


    This cannot be emphasized enough. All of my religious friends are in a tizzy today because they are somehow taking this ruling to mean that government will now force their church to marry same sex couples. Personally, I would be equally as emphatic in opposition were this to ever happen (which it won't) as I was in favor of same-sex marriage.


    I was super upset because now I have no excuse to avoid getting married! crybaby


    :icon_lol: :icon_lol:
  • Ironrod
    Ironrod
    GT Member
    Marriage equality has been the law in MA for 10 years. What seemed audacious then is unremarkable now. Ten years from now the rest of the country will most likely feel the same way -- by 2025 everyone will wonder why this was ever a big deal.
  • Lee
    Lee
    GT Member
    on 1435375346:

    Marriage equality has been the law in MA for 10 years. What seemed audacious then is unremarkable now. Ten years from now the rest of the country will most likely feel the same way -- by 2025 everyone will wonder why this was ever a big deal.


    Said like someone who has never been to the Midwest. :icon_smile:
  • leo8877
    leo8877
    GT Member
    on 1435381646:

    on 1435375346:

    Marriage equality has been the law in MA for 10 years. What seemed audacious then is unremarkable now. Ten years from now the rest of the country will most likely feel the same way -- by 2025 everyone will wonder why this was ever a big deal.


    Said like someone who has never been to the Midwest. :icon_smile:


    Or the South!
  • Ironrod
    Ironrod
    GT Member
    on 1435428763:

    on 1435381646:

    on 1435375346:

    Marriage equality has been the law in MA for 10 years. What seemed audacious then is unremarkable now. Ten years from now the rest of the country will most likely feel the same way -- by 2025 everyone will wonder why this was ever a big deal.


    Said like someone who has never been to the Midwest. :icon_smile:


    Or the South!


    I was born and raised in the Midwest and often visited kinfolk in the South, but I've been a Yankee for so long that I lose perspective. Do you think this is going to fester over time? Will people resist it actively or passively?
  • dfs
    dfs
    GT Member
    Midwest here. 10 years ago friends hid their orientation in order to keep their jobs. Today other good friends are getting married. I think the world is changing and folks will find something else to worry about.
  • Isgrimnur
    Isgrimnur
    GT Member
    Much like racism, there will always be holdouts, and some of them might even become radicalized. But the ship has sailed on it being something that can be put back in the closet, so to speak.
  • Dante Rising
    Dante Rising
    GT Member
    Congratulations! I'm certain the divorce court lawyers across the nation are at their local bars, buying drinks for everybody! A whole new class of clients!
  • Exodor
    Exodor
    GT Member
    on 1435446132:

    Do you think this is going to fester over time? Will people resist it actively or passively?


    I heard someone on NPR claim this will remain an issue for years after the ruling much like abortion after Roe v Wade - but I'm not sure that's really possible. Abortion opponents have been chipping away at abortion rights ever since but I don't really see how you can wage the same sort of campaign against gay marriage - you can either get a marriage license or you can't. There doesn't seem to be the same gray areas for opponents to exploit.


    I think there will always be a segment of the population that opposes gay marriage (evangelical Christians, mainly) but for the bulk of the nation it will just become a thing. I know when we explained the ruling to our 10 year old she seems a little unimpressed and confused about why it was even something up for debate - it just seems normal for her that people would just marry whoever they loved.
  • hepcat
    hepcat
    GT Member
    The only people that oppose this are Christians with antiquated, questionable values. The same values that saw them so actively oppose interracial marriages not that long ago.
  • Punisher
    Punisher
    GT Member
    on 1435350327:

    on 1435331663:

    I expect certain people to be very upset about this.


    I was super upset because now I have no excuse to avoid getting married! :crybaby:


    This is exactly why many in the gay and lesbian community should have been against it..
    "Of course I love you and want to get married, but alas, it is not legal, so we can't.. What can you do?"

  • Isgrimnur
    Isgrimnur
    GT Member
    on 1435596773:

    The only people that oppose this are Christians with antiquated, questionable values. The same values that saw them so actively oppose interracial marriages not that long ago.


    When having a discussion with my father about this issue and his and my mother's thoughts on how it would demean her marriage, I took that exact argument to him. As a career military man, I have never seen anything remotely racist in any of his behaviors, or my mother's, for that matter. I don't know how he responded to it, as we rarely have conversations in that vein, and it's usually in response to a discussion around her statements and behavior.

    What was funny was the thought that my mother apparently voiced to him at one point that she felt I had been liberalized by my college, which is square in the middle of conservative bastion of West Texas.
  • Lee
    Lee
    GT Member
    on 1435596773:

    The only people that oppose this are Christians with antiquated, questionable values. The same values that saw them so actively oppose interracial marriages not that long ago.


    I think people who live on the coasts and large cities are forgetting that fact. Jesusland is huge, and unlike racism, they believe they can directly link being gay as a sin to the Bible. And it isn't even like it an older generation stuck in their ways, the young Christians feel just as strongly as their parents did. Christians are not just going to drop this and become accepting of this anytime soon. Instead they will react as ATB has, and take it as some sort of attack on their beliefs.

    In the military over the years, I worked with a lot of Christian's from small midwestern towns, they are not going to become more accepting anytime soon, and they are going to teach their kids the same standards.
  • Gratch
    Gratch
    GT Member
    on 1435599097:

    And it isn't even like it an older generation stuck in their ways, the young Christians feel just as strongly as their parents did. Christians are not just going to drop this and become accepting of this anytime soon. Instead they will react as ATB has, and take it as some sort of attack on their beliefs.


    Much of the demographic data suggests otherwise, although I would be interested to see a stat on millennials who specifically identify as Christian

    6-8-2015-11-25-48-AM.png
  • Isgrimnur
    Isgrimnur
    GT Member
    The Silent generation? I haven't heard of that one before.
  • Lee
    Lee
    GT Member
    Ironically, I was in class tonight (Business Ethics) and same sex marriage was brought up. Everyone in the class, (20 people) is enlisted, retired, or a spouse/child of military. I was the only one who was for it, although one girl told me on break she agrees with me just wasn't saying so in class. Enlisted military are a breed of their own, but it was a nice reminder of how different it can be.

    Interesting, to me anyway, me and that girl were the only Air Force, everyone else was Navy/Marines.
  • hepcat
    hepcat
    GT Member
    on 1435636005:

    The Silent generation? I haven't heard of that one before.


    ooooh, i saw what you did there. :ninja:
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